Antique-shop.com
Antiques! => Antique Questions Forum => Topic started by: benbenny007 on March 02, 2017, 02:18:40 pm
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(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah188/benbenny007/20170302_163012_zpsf0us5mhu.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/benbenny007/media/20170302_163012_zpsf0us5mhu.jpg.html)
My new project.
Any knowledge about this artist? I first bought it without knowing it had a signature. The previous owner had no idea what it was and sold it to me as a painting with no signature. Only things which let me to buy than were the numbers and inscriptions on the stretcher which could point out that it was hanging somewhere in a gallery, museum or part of a collection. Looking at it now after all these years and can see very vaguely a signature which I missed the first time, its almost impossible to read.
I believe the signature is made out of two names and followed by a year. The first name probably reads Frank I'm guessing, or does it read something else? (picture below with the paper snip is where the signature stops.)
The signature is partly covered with paint It appears as if the artist signed the canvas first before he started painting.
Need to know the age of the canvas and frame to start research, is it 18th or 19th century? I'm guessing its mid/late 18th century?? Its painted in a unusual style for a painting from that time period. It shows a village scene and two knitting women to the left.
Does somebody has the artist books or knows this style. It was bought in the UK so it can be a English artist? but it could also be Dutch because of the name Frank.
I know its all about details and I got plenty pictures below, maybe that will help.
Any help is welcome
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah188/benbenny007/20170302_163034_zps5az5333c.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/benbenny007/media/20170302_163034_zps5az5333c.jpg.html)
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah188/benbenny007/20170302_163100_zpsxkdejkgd.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/benbenny007/media/20170302_163100_zpsxkdejkgd.jpg.html)
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah188/benbenny007/20170302_163111_zpsqftmnhsh.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/benbenny007/media/20170302_163111_zpsqftmnhsh.jpg.html)
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah188/benbenny007/20170302_163129_zpsfvf5xhwp.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/benbenny007/media/20170302_163129_zpsfvf5xhwp.jpg.html)
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah188/benbenny007/20170302_163221_zpsskf9qdaq.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/benbenny007/media/20170302_163221_zpsskf9qdaq.jpg.html)
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah188/benbenny007/20170302_163247_zpslcoezzn2.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/benbenny007/media/20170302_163247_zpslcoezzn2.jpg.html)
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah188/benbenny007/20170302_163329_zps70zynf7g.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/benbenny007/media/20170302_163329_zps70zynf7g.jpg.html)
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah188/benbenny007/20170302_163300_zpspfzvf4qq.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/benbenny007/media/20170302_163300_zpspfzvf4qq.jpg.html)
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah188/benbenny007/20170302_163354_zpse6tyvfav.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/benbenny007/media/20170302_163354_zpse6tyvfav.jpg.html)
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah188/benbenny007/20170302_163402_zpszyu0kjdb.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/benbenny007/media/20170302_163402_zpszyu0kjdb.jpg.html)
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah188/benbenny007/20170302_163504_zpsl302ay5f.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/benbenny007/media/20170302_163504_zpsl302ay5f.jpg.html)
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No success yet with identifying the signature.
Drives me crazy. Any help on age to start more specific research on artist from that time period.
Is my guess correct that the first name is FRANK ? Need second opinions
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah188/benbenny007/Untitleduuu_zpsg4jpd8sp.png) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/benbenny007/media/Untitleduuu_zpsg4jpd8sp.png.html)
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Funny, the first artist I thought of was an early California artist, Franz Bischoff. Obviously not, but vaguely similar in style, maybe a first name of Franz(?) might be worth investigating. Good luck.
http://www.the-athenaeum.org/art/detail.php?ID=44876 (http://www.the-athenaeum.org/art/detail.php?ID=44876)
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Nothing yet,, still looking !!
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It could be a American artist. Painting was bought in London so it can be a artist from any country because London is a multicultural city and people come and go every day..
I managed to get the signature a bit clearer by making the black ink wet which made it darker.
Not sure if the signature exist out of two names and a year, or three names?
Looks like the end read 02 or 03 but not sure. need help.
(http://i1380.photobucket.com/albums/ah188/benbenny007/20170304_215445ss_zpspztra5i4.jpg) (http://s1380.photobucket.com/user/benbenny007/media/20170304_215445ss_zpspztra5i4.jpg.html)
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Let me study the new pics later,, making bread now !! It is two names !!
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Frank Dane or Pane. Have to look.
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You are searching wrong. Always look for the details!
First all its not early 19th century and certainly not 18th century! Its also not Dutch.
The canvas is not that old! It is made from sack cloth. Artists re-use old canvas because it can be available without paying any cash, something artists are usually very short of. Recycling is nothing new, neither is chucking out stuff that others can use. The name Frank is used in different countries. Other fact is that's impressionist in style, so Id say more early 20th century. This particular combination of landscape, architecture, and clothing, indicates it is not Dutch. The costume of the lady in the back looks like a generic French peasant costume, with a white 'fichu' or kerchief and a white cap with flaps hanging down the sides. This style of dress was still worn in the first half of the twentieth century. That model white cap was also worn in parts of Belgium. But in Belgium white-washed villages are seen in the flat lowlands, not the hills.
My conclusion, it is French, or at least painted in France, in an early twentieth century style, in the early twentieth century. I have a large collection of regional costumes from different countries. I have most publications on Dutch regional dress from Bing & Braet onwards, including some Bing & Braet/Frans Buffa publication original lithographs. I can assure you that from the 19th century till now there are no Dutch caps that look like that. Most white caps were worn over precious metal frames (oorijzers) anyway, you would at least see some gold glistening through the white.
The north of the country, Friesland, Groningen, Drenthe, West Friesland, did have white kerchiefs for sunday dress, often over silk tops, but different caps, and this is nowhere near the flat, green north of The Netherlands.
It is also hard to find yellow stone and white-washed villages with red roofs and pale blue shutters in the few 'hilly' areas. And look at the way the roof of the first house on the left looks. A Dutchman would have repaired that straight away, after all, what would the neighbours think;)!
The combination of the yellow and white houses with pale blue shutters and lovely sloping roofs, the villagers and the landscape, reminds me very much of rural parts of Burgundy. Including the picturesque state of disrepair.
But I can't be 100% certain.
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Despite the borderline rude tone of the comments, which also caused a stir with the forum regulars in the Chinese Painting thread, I believe that Chrislondo-London is right: This is probably French, early 20th century. You can tell that this artist has seen Cezanne. Also, the way the frame (which looks contemporary to the painting) is molded looks to be from that time period as well. My guess: 1910-1930.
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It's English, he's called Frank Dean ( 1865-1946 ) but might be from a follower / school of the artist where someone has " borrowed " his signature.
Looking at the subject matter, style and technique, i'd say it's possibly the latter, although i have seen differences in an artists's work during their career ( particularly going from early to peak or from peak to later years )
Frank Dean was 81 when he passed away and this might have been one of his later works.
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It's English, he's called Frank Dean ( 1865-1946 ) but might be from a follower / school of the artist where someone has " borrowed " his signature.
Looking at the subject matter, style and technique, i'd say it's possibly the latter, although i have seen differences in an artists's work during their career ( particularly going from early to peak or from peak to later years )
Frank Dean was 81 when he passed away and this might have been one of his later works.
No its not Frank Dean!
Its not even close to his works, style and signatures. I have subscriptions to all mayor art databases and no work, style or signature comes close to this one.
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The signature is Frank Dean
It is similar to a few of his paintings
If you read my post, i said it might not have been painted by Frank Dean
Example
https://www.the-saleroom.com/en-gb/auction-catalogues/keys-aylsham-salerooms/catalogue-id-srkey10056/lot-38eecd7b-3556-4e5b-b7a1-a4440046dbea
Signature
http://www.tate.org.uk/art/images/research/831_10.jpg
To say that signature doesn't even come close is incorrect. The same " font ", the same drop on the K.
He painted some very grand, expansive paintings but i've appraised and valued enough in my time to know that saying this isn't him could be a mistake similar to which you warned Mat about in another thread.
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The "Frank" definitely looks similar, although it looks like the last name is longer than "Dean."
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I am going with Ipcress on this one !! But I don`t think its late in his career !! The canvas and frame have too much age for that !! I think its an early one !! His style simply evolved as other artists do !! But the basics are the same as his other paintings !!
Someone said there might be numbers at the end of the last name !!
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I am going with Ipcress on this one !! But I don`t think its late in his career !! The canvas and frame have too much age for that !! I think its an early one !! His style simply evolved as other artists do !! But the basics are the same as his other paintings !!
Someone said there might be numbers at the end of the last name !!
The frame looks like first half of the 20th century, 1910-1930. Who said that there might be numbers at the end of the last name? If that were true then it would all make more sense.
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Who said that there might be numbers at the end of the last name? If that were true then it would all make more sense.
Benbenny did somewhere in this thread !!
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Ahh...."Two Names Followed by a Year."
There you go! Looks like Ipcress was right.
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https://media.mutualart.com/Images/2012_11/21/12/122716694/2b732bf1-60c4-469a-93c9-1293f7645fa5_570.Jpeg
The rocks in that are painted in a similar style. Muted tones in both paintings.
Might be him, might be a follower but the signature is possibly followed by a date or location ( Dean sometimes wrote one or the other )
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The signature is Frank Dean
It is similar to a few of his paintings
If you read my post, i said it might not have been painted by Frank Dean
Example
https://www.the-saleroom.com/en-gb/auction-catalogues/keys-aylsham-salerooms/catalogue-id-srkey10056/lot-38eecd7b-3556-4e5b-b7a1-a4440046dbea
Signature
http://www.tate.org.uk/art/images/research/831_10.jpg
To say that signature doesn't even come close is incorrect. The same " font ", the same drop on the K.
He painted some very grand, expansive paintings but i've appraised and valued enough in my time to know that saying this isn't him could be a mistake similar to which you warned Mat about in another thread.
Still not convinced.
A signature is like a fingerprint and gives away clues, Ive copied the picture and draw over it and was not a match. Best way to identify a signature.
BenBenny, you need to look for a artist that signs his first name with a loop in the letter K, Frank Dean never used a loop in the K, not in a early period and also not in a later period. Think the last name should end with double LL or TT, could also be a H. Also not sure his last name starts with the letter D, it looks more like a P or a R, difficult to tell.
Think your right about the date after a signature, can see something what looks like the number 02 to me but not sure.
Use the same method shown below and I'm sure you will find out who the artist is. Take a sheet of paper and write down the possibilities and go trough them one by one. There are plenty website artist databases like FINDARTINFO, ARTNET, ARTPRICE which you can use, you can't use all the tools on thsee websites if your not subscribed but you can do general artist searches. It would be ideal if you know somebody who is native French. They have more experience with French lastnames and can help you on the right way
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e77/Ben_Amrani/20170304_215445ss_zpsjdr49o2x.jpg) (http://s37.photobucket.com/user/Ben_Amrani/media/20170304_215445ss_zpsjdr49o2x.jpg.html)
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" best way to identify a signature "
when you can't see that signature clearly ?
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" best way to identify a signature "
when you can't see that signature clearly ?
Yes! Especially when it's unreadable! All the best auction houses and expert use this simple method. You can mimick the handwriting and find clues.
It did help! It proofed your were wrong along with you forum buddy's who thought you were correct.. Swallow the facts mate, we all make mistakes.
Two so far agree with you on Frank Dean. I say its not! Proof me I'm wrong.
Yes, I know!! I don't care!
Try it! It's liberating!
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Oh, get over yourself.
I've worked for big auction houses and nobody used that method. I've appraised museum collections which have gone to auction and set record prices.
Meanwhile, you're trolling on an internet forum and making snide remarks. And here's my " proof " :
Despite stating on the previous page that it might be a follower of Frank Dean and not actually him, you've ignored that - such is your eagerness to prove ( that's how you spell it in the past tense, by the way ) someone wrong and win the argument like a schoolboy.
My " buddies " on here know a thing or four about antiques and have never been so condescending and immature when discussing an issue like this.
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https://artuk.org/discover/artworks/on-the-irish-coast-37867
In Ipcress defense,, artist signatures can change and evolve throughout their career !! And much depends on the mood that artist was in that day !! Here the F if different but the K remains the same and notice the D looks very like a P on first glance !! You also have to take the texture of the canvas/medium into account !! Rough medium will look different from a smooth surface !!
There are enough points for a Frank Dean signature !!
Chrislondo-London can you come up with a better one ??
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Did i hit a sensitive spot? Still not convinced.
I learned not to trust auctioneers. They make every day big mistakes and never admit they are/were wrong! Must be a reputation thing.
Ghopher1924. That signature doesnt come close. Show me a signature of Frank Dean with a loop in the K. The last name is to long to be Dean. Fact!
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Welp...I did the signature line thingy that Chrislodo-London suggested several times...and it always comes out Frank Deane??
There are artists with the last name PEAN but no Frank!
I am sure there is more than one Frank Dean in the world!
Did the "renowned" Frank Dean only sign on the left side of the painting?
Chrislondo-London, since you feel so strongly about this maybe you can help benbenny007 find a reputable "hands on" appraiser that you feel would best help them. Are y'all near eachother? (I believe you are both in the UK and know it is really big but you may even be in the same city?!?! area?!?!?) There is only so much that can be done with a picture and the actual item isn't in hand. Hopefully it would be worthwhile to get a hands-on appraisal.
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Excellent idea KC !! They are in the same city I think !! Please post a link to the gallery so we can read the results !! That should be a simple task for both of you !!
Did i hit a sensitive spot? Still not convinced.
And no !! No sensitive spot !! Just pure logic and a bit of knowledge !!
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Ghopher1924? LOL!! ;D :o
At least spell my "name" right!
Time to put this one to bed.
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I'm not convinced it's a loop in the K. If we were to consider every black line as part of the signature, i can see umlauts and a line which connects the N and K.
It's a faded signature with a photo take at an angle and some of those dark horizontals are just the canvas stitches.
Dean put hyphens after his name, sometimes wrote the location or date and that's why it appears longer.
http://gallery.nen.gov.uk/asset658800_14080-e2bn.html
http://www.sothebys.com/en/auctions/ecatalogue/2008/19th-century-european-art-including-the-orientalist-sale-n08431/lot.148.html
( both upper case )
https://static.artuk.org/w1200h1200/WYL/WYL_LMG_012_021.jpg
https://static.artuk.org/w1200h1200/WYL/WYL_LMG_039_03.jpg
( lower case, the latter with a date )
https://cdn.globalauctionplatform.com/ca6ad7b5-a793-4ffe-8be6-a68601114cf3/2963fc01-9b9e-454e-863d-a6860114dd68/original.jpg
( upper case with a full stop, slash and date )
So what you presume to be letters of a longer surname could be full stops, hyphens or numbers
Finally, these two paintings
http://images1.bonhams.com/image?src=Images/live/2011-05/12/8312743-1-3.JPG&width=640&height=480&autosizefit=1
http://www.hoteldesventesdegeneve.auction.fr/_fr/lot/frank-dean-1865-1947-paysage-automnal-au-moulin-huile-sur-carton-signee-et-7554354#.WMNQcaJBrIU
More impressionist, like the one from the first post in this thread
Some auctioneers have listed his dates as 1865 to 1907 but that last year is when he flourished ( 1885-1907 ). He was born in 1865, died 1947.
The painting might even be France, where he lived in his late teens / early 20s.
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That 02 may indeed be an 07 !!
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I'm not convinced it's a loop in the K. If we were to consider every black line as part of the signature, i can see umlauts and a line which connects the N and K.
It's a faded signature with a photo take at an angle and some of those dark horizontals are just the canvas stitches.
Dean put hyphens after his name, sometimes wrote the location or date and that's why it appears longer.
Still not convinced. It clearly shows a loop in the letter K which Frank Dean never did.
Also the letters A and N in the last name of Dean (if it is Dean) should be the same style as in the First name Frank, doesn't look like its a match. My guess is that it's a lastnames with double LL OR TT. Otherwise their should be a space the last name and the following work like in every other works signed by Frank Dean.
Facts show else and you cant deny facts.
I don't come here to argue, tmnothing wrong with critics, just want to help.
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e77/Ben_Amrani/proxy_zps3iwwc4j6.jpg) (http://s37.photobucket.com/user/Ben_Amrani/media/proxy_zps3iwwc4j6.jpg.html)
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e77/Ben_Amrani/Capture11111_zpsub9qbgvr.jpg) (http://s37.photobucket.com/user/Ben_Amrani/media/Capture11111_zpsub9qbgvr.jpg.html)
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e77/Ben_Amrani/Capture111111_zpskjehemum.jpg) (http://s37.photobucket.com/user/Ben_Amrani/media/Capture111111_zpskjehemum.jpg.html)
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e77/Ben_Amrani/Capture1111111_zpspr6owt8x.jpg) (http://s37.photobucket.com/user/Ben_Amrani/media/Capture1111111_zpspr6owt8x.jpg.html)
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e77/Ben_Amrani/Capture1111_zpssbvlscsl.jpg) (http://s37.photobucket.com/user/Ben_Amrani/media/Capture1111_zpssbvlscsl.jpg.html)
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e77/Ben_Amrani/Capture1_zps4aa3mshb.jpg) (http://s37.photobucket.com/user/Ben_Amrani/media/Capture1_zps4aa3mshb.jpg.html)
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e77/Ben_Amrani/Capture11_zps8ikebozp.jpg) (http://s37.photobucket.com/user/Ben_Amrani/media/Capture11_zps8ikebozp.jpg.html)
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e77/Ben_Amrani/Capture111_zps5kulvq1a.jpg) (http://s37.photobucket.com/user/Ben_Amrani/media/Capture111_zps5kulvq1a.jpg.html)
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There are differences in those letters in the signatures in the links provided.
There are full stops and slashes immediately after his name in the links provided.
" every other works " is wrong and exactly the kind of language you told Mat not to use.
I'm done arguing with a troll.
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I'm done arguing with a troll.
What a language! I hope you teach your kids better. Seems like I hurt your feelings. Keep in mind that internet is only virtual! I proofed you were/are wrong. You will be not the first or last wannebe valuation expert that will not admit his/her mistakes.
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Wow! Did I miss something!? Thank you all for the help, its much appreciated. ChrisLondo-London, thank you for your help but I don't really want it if it needs to be like this way!
So its Frank Dean! That's a keeper than! Thank you for that Ipcress, your the best. Love this website!
Now I can finally name it and give it a place. I just looked up the artist and seen the prices he's selling for. How can I find out the value of this piece? Auction?
But I did make a big mistake. I can remember when I bought this artwork there was also a other painting of the same artist which was sold to somebody else. Should had bought it!! It was a very beautiful portrait painting of a Nobel man posing on a chair. Well we can't have all the luck :-)
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Thank you BenBenny007 for your trust but always be open for a second opinion! Don't get carried away by the comments from others. These are all the main forum-buddys that want to buildup this website and don't want to admit their mistakes. Imagine what would happen if they had it wrong!, nobody would take them seriously anymore. Believe me, Ive seen them make so many mistakes that I decided to signup and do something about it.
You’ve just told me exactly what I needed to know and I will proof it with facts and not guesses. Your comment about a other portrait painting of a nobel man from the same artist which sold to someone else was the breakthrough.
Ipcress-Amateur! Its not Frank Dean but Frank Daniell.
Frank Daniell 1866-1932 Suffolk, Colchester, UK.
Same style, same period and known for his portraits of nobility!
Daniell is best known as a portrait painter whose subjects were the celebrities of the day such as Mayors and many prominent people in the life of the town of Colchester. In addition to painting portraits he also completed some noteworthy still life works and travelled in Europe
BenBenny007, you suspected it to be a Dutch artist or scene, I said it was a French artist or painted in France because of the clothing and background. There is a small chance that it is painted in The Netherlands because the painting below was also painted in The Netherlands. Its hard to tell because its impressionist in style same like the painting shown in the link below so details don't show.
I quote Ipcress: There are full stops and slashes immediately ''AFTER HIS NAME'' in the links provided.
My scans show the last name as Daniell with a full stop ''AFTER'' the letters LL! Not before them! It also shows the last inscriptions being numbers 02 which appear to relate to the date 1902. If you do your research about where the artist was in the year 1902 than you can also probably give the painting a title and a place. Maybe he toured trough other country's and France was maybe one of them.
https://artuk.org/discover/artworks/entrance-at-middleburg-holland-2367/search/actor:daniell-frank-18661932/page/1/view_as/grid
https://artuk.org/discover/artworks/search/actor:daniell-frank-18661932/page/2
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e77/Ben_Amrani/Untitledfdgh_zps3fcvppgc.png) (http://s37.photobucket.com/user/Ben_Amrani/media/Untitledfdgh_zps3fcvppgc.png.html)
And to finish it off
The so called experts here also overlooked the back of the painting!! There are plenty of inscriptions on the stretcher with clues. BenBenny007 You can clearly see in the pictures you've uploaded that there is writing on the back of the stretchers. You can still clearly see writing in white chalk the letters D A N and vaguely the letter at the end LL
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e77/Ben_Amrani/20170302_16310000_zps8vklqkqn.jpg) (http://s37.photobucket.com/user/Ben_Amrani/media/20170302_16310000_zps8vklqkqn.jpg.html)
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e77/Ben_Amrani/20170302_16310000000_zpskp25ml77.jpg) (http://s37.photobucket.com/user/Ben_Amrani/media/20170302_16310000000_zpskp25ml77.jpg.html)
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e77/Ben_Amrani/Capturehjkc_zps8yhjbasb.jpg) (http://s37.photobucket.com/user/Ben_Amrani/media/Capturehjkc_zps8yhjbasb.jpg.html)
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e77/Ben_Amrani/Capturehjkcv_zps7rvf6kpb.jpg) (http://s37.photobucket.com/user/Ben_Amrani/media/Capturehjkcv_zps7rvf6kpb.jpg.html)
(http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e77/Ben_Amrani/Capturehjkcvvv_zpsjznckanr.jpg) (http://s37.photobucket.com/user/Ben_Amrani/media/Capturehjkcvvv_zpsjznckanr.jpg.html)
Chrislondo-London drops the mic obama style
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Only one problem with that theory !! Frank Daniell painted no landscapes that I have found and the style does not match !! He did religious paintings, church interiors, genre`paintings and portraits !! With portrait artists and landscape artists,, rarely the two meet !! When he toured Europe he did church and religious paintings no landscapes are found !!
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It seems like it's Chrislondo and Benbenny against the world! It's almost as if they're the same person! :o
Good comments, Mart. Actually, I think Ipcress sewed this one up already. Of course, we're just a bunch of dummies! But if we're so dumb, then why do they/he keep coming back? ;D
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Really?
After all the evidence provided?
Done arguing! Dodgy website. I will unsubscribe
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;D ;D ;D
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I have been on this site for four years. It is a site that tries to help people. It is not a site of experts; just knowledgeable people trying to help, research, and learn from each other. I have stated opposing opinnons and seen "so called buddies" disagree with each other. Everyone does this with a common thread of curtesy. Chrislondo, you could be correct but your tone and attitude is offensive. People are not here to "drop a mic" on each other. If you do not want be helpful in a civil way perhaps you are prudent in unsubscribing.
PeLady
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Really?
After all the evidence provided?
Done arguing! Dodgy website. I will unsubscribe
No sense in thinking you or anyone need to argue here. I view this as an educational site where everyone has something to offer, and as adults we can draw our own conclusions based on rationality. For example, this current discussion has brought up the names of two artists that I was never aware of before. Regardless if I ever utilize the information in the future or not, I’m glad I took the time to explore their work and biographies. Life is too short not to keep open minds to share and accept knowledge and experience
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FROM THE MODERATOR:
This thread has gone from being confrontational, to demeaning forum members as-well-as the integrity of the forum itself. (This started on another thread.) The site founder started it as a hobby - a common place where people could come together to share, learn and enjoy themselves in a caring forum – and I know that is what he wants it to continue to be. The forum welcomes differing opinions but will not become a name-calling, combative, degrading site that has been the demise of so many forums. No matter what motivates individuals to join the forum, we welcome people willing to share treasures, share their knowledge, help people learn/discern and do it in a civil manner. At times members may "agree-to-disagree" and are expected to do so with respect. We hope that all can work to get along for the good.
AS A REMINDER – Antique-Shop is made up of Volunteers from around the world that meet here for a mutual love of preserving the past. We welcome people with diverse backgrounds/opinions and the quest to provide support as to the history of treasures - that is what makes this site wonderfully educational and personable. The Antique-Shop has established itself as a great resource because of members generously taking their time (sometimes hours, days or months) to help inquiring people get answers…for FREE. Members/moderators are not monetarily or materially compensated. However, they do get lots of satisfaction because of a love for things old, helping others figure out their treasures and learning along the way. As a result, great camaraderie has developed not only for long-time regulars but for newcomers as well. Anyone that perused this site on a regular basis will see that we don’t know everything. There are times we know what items are but there are times we are confounded by an item, have changed our minds on findings or unable to help. Oftentimes we recommend for people to seek help from museums, appraisers, experts, specialized forums and often go so far as to help them connect with some. (As stated early in this thread that a hands-on inspection from someone in-the-know would be the best route for benbenny007. So many times there is so much more that can be seen in-person that can't always be seen from pictures on the internet.)
benbenny007, we only wish you the best!
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Well said KC !! There have been times when we each have differing opinions and a few where I have had to eat my words !!
That may be the case here !! But we have given some points to think about !! Like KC ,,I suggest a hands on by a reputable gallery in the area !! Hopefully whatever it is,,it will be a good one for Benbenny !!
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It's too bad that it had to be said, but you said it well KC!! Thanks!
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Thank you Chrislondo-london!! You have indeed proved it with facts! Sorry that I didn't believed you at first. Was carried away by the ''so called experts'' (amateurs) on this forum. I've been to the auction house with this evidence you've provided and they also named the painting to Frank Daniel. They managed to contact the museum which exhibits the collection of Frank Daniel and they seem interested :-).
Thanks so much Chrislondo-London!! I will also unsubscribe to this website!! Can't afford big mistakes which cost me money!!
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Post the link to the auction house and the question you asked that gave you the information !! We would be interested in reading it !!
Prove what you say !!
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Similar grammatical mistakes with those two posters.
No loop on the K in his signature :D , generally dated his works beneath that signaure, painted classic portraits.
I still doubt it's Daniell
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DANG! Once again, I missed all the drama as i have not been following this thread as it is not in my field of interest. Gee Wiz, it seems the forum has picked up 2 drama queens at the SAME TIME! Or maybe 1 DQ with 2 handles?
Earth to the drama queen/s, this forum provides general information about antique objects primarily from posters who supply photographs and brief summaries about their object. I don't know about paintings but as for old furniture, there is NO WAY to authenticate old furniture from photo's alone, it simply can't be done without an in person examination.
If you can't be respectful of other opinions, please take your drama elsewhere, i don't think it is wanted here.
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Post the link to the auction house and the question you asked that gave you the information !! We would be interested in reading it !!
Prove what you say !!
Good luck with that one, Mart. My guess would be that there has been no consultation at all. It's time to ban this guy.
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It's time to ban this guy.
Agrees! Some people have emotional issues that this forum can't fix.
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It's time to ban this guy
Thing is, how do you know it's a guy? it could be a girl!
Wishes we could get some troll action on the old furniture side of things! They mostly always come here on topics i know nothing about and i end up missing ALL the drama!
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After what KC has told me, it should be a ban.
It's not the portrait artist Frank Daniell and i hope this person / those two aren't trying to con someone into purchasing it. Referencing a specialist forum when selling an item might work in their favour.
What a pair person !
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Referencing a specialist forum when selling an item
Yeah, good point, never thought of that but in today's world, ANYTHING is possible!
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Sure is - you guys voted Trump in !!!!!
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Ipcress.....you are an whipper snapper, instigator. Luckily, everyone is tooooooo smart to take the bait! 😜
(http://www.cartoonbrew.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/secretlifeofpets_record-1280x600.jpg)
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Here ya go!
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Here ya go!
Want to see my membership card ?? ;D Oh I read that,, just decided (for once) to keep my mouth shut !! The UK has enough problems !!
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Don't tell me you're one of those people, KC ?!!!
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You mean the intelligent ones ??
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Sure is - you guys voted Trump in !!!!!
You can't pin that on ME !!
I didn't vote for that guy.
lol
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Back to antiques !! I am already on one political forum !! Thats enough for me !!
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Totally agree Mart. That is what I was aiming for. This has already been an exciting enough thread! :)
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I second that motion!!