Author Topic: Opinions? 1600s Gothic medieval 17th century oak bible box  (Read 7420 times)

KC

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Re: Opinions? 1600s Gothic medieval 17th century oak bible box
« Reply #15 on: September 23, 2010, 01:28:26 am »
To add to waywards observations....I would ask them to take a pic of the lid where it is supposed to "lock in" to the front "lock mortise" piece.....

See if they meet up or if the top/slanted piece even has any grooves, etc.


This could reasonably be an antique writing box w/slope     
« Last Edit: September 23, 2010, 01:41:28 am by KC »
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cogar

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Re: Opinions? 1600s Gothic medieval 17th century oak bible box
« Reply #16 on: September 23, 2010, 07:13:25 am »
I don't know whether it will help but it wouldn't hurt to read what I found, to wit:

American Collector Archive
Flashback: Bible Boxes Were Also Desks
 
 http://www.collectorsweekly.com/articles/bible-boxes-were-also-desks/

jacon4

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Re: Opinions? 1600s Gothic medieval 17th century oak bible box
« Reply #17 on: November 26, 2010, 05:52:01 am »
Alrighty then, lol, although late to this post i came to this board yesterday while doing a search on bible boxes as i am bidding on one today. The term "bible box" is a 19th century/victorian term, it is highly unlikely these boxes were used to store bibles in the 17th/18th centuries as books were very expensive and only rich folks could afford them. It is much more likely they were used to store individual personal items which is why most have a lock. To get a feel for authentic early oak furniture, check out this site, although english, it's got some really fabulous stuff. Some pieces are from the same workshop where Thomas Dennis, Americas most celebrated 17th century joiner, learned his trade.

http://www.marhamchurchantiques.com/

And now on to the object of my lust today, it's a "bible box" from connecticut dated 1716. I am due for a win, wish me luck!

http://www.garths.com/asp/fullCatalogue.asp?salelot=1054+++++++8+&refno=++194879


Oceans64

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Re: Opinions? 1600s Gothic medieval 17th century oak bible box
« Reply #18 on: November 26, 2010, 09:54:48 am »
Wow Jacon - That is a beautiful piece.  Good Luck!  Let us know if you win  ;D
"In times like these, it is helpful to remember that there have always been times like these." — Paul Harvey

talesofthesevenseas

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Re: Opinions? 1600s Gothic medieval 17th century oak bible box
« Reply #19 on: November 26, 2010, 12:48:18 pm »
That is a stunning piece and loaded with history! Good luck and let us know how it turns out, we'll be rootin' for you!

I found the auction houses genealogical note very interesting, that the Ruth Allen they found wasn't christened until the year of her death, when she lived in a time of fairly strict religious practices, when most people were christened in childhood. Interesting.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2010, 12:55:21 pm by talesofthesevenseas »
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jacon4

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Re: Opinions? 1600s Gothic medieval 17th century oak bible box
« Reply #20 on: November 26, 2010, 01:24:17 pm »
Well, I lost, big time, crushed actually, oh well, losing is a big part of collecting. Ruth's box went for $8435. over 4 times it's high estimate. It is a wonderful piece of early americana, i just wasnt willing to pay that much for it.

talesofthesevenseas

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Re: Opinions? 1600s Gothic medieval 17th century oak bible box
« Reply #21 on: November 26, 2010, 01:49:43 pm »
Wow, sounds like there was either a "bidding war" or the estimate was way off. It could also have been a situation where a family member was determined to reclaim it at any price. Sorry you didn't get this one! Keep us posted when you find another.
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jacon4

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Re: Opinions? 1600s Gothic medieval 17th century oak bible box
« Reply #22 on: November 26, 2010, 03:10:26 pm »
Well, although i wasnt there, i dont think it was a case of auction fever between 2 bidders because the bidding was strong, powerful and sustained, indicating many bidders until it went over 6k, at which point bidding slowed. It's often difficult to estimate something like this, it had condition issues like replaced bottom, patch on front and was repainted, that usually keeps the price down to one thousand or less. On the other hand, it had alot going for it, it was verifiable american (a big deal), was very early (1716) and the provenance of Florene Maine (a big time antique dealer at a time when it wasnt cool for females to do that sort of thing, she opened her shop in 1928) all contributed to the price and overcame all those condition issues.

Oceans64

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Re: Opinions? 1600s Gothic medieval 17th century oak bible box
« Reply #23 on: November 26, 2010, 05:37:31 pm »
Sorry you lost it...  It was a beauty for sure!  I'm with Tales. Would love to see more if you find one.
"In times like these, it is helpful to remember that there have always been times like these." — Paul Harvey

jacon4

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Re: Opinions? 1600s Gothic medieval 17th century oak bible box
« Reply #24 on: November 29, 2010, 06:23:07 am »
LOL, and the hits just keep on comming...... Paul Fitzsimmons ( owner of marhamchurch antiques) emails me when he gets something in that he thinks i might be interested in. After my recent fiasco with Ruth's box, Paul emails me about this box
http://www.marhamchurchantiques.com/antique/boarded-oak-box-original-polychromy-probably-constructed-same-workshop-which-thomas-dennis-a
So i email him back and ask the price, i got the reply this morning

Dear James,Thank you for yourr kind e-mail re the box, it is the best of its type I have ever come across. Currently I have a museum interested and awaiting to hear back from them as to wether they can raise the funds. If however it becomes avalible I will let you know. Kind regards Paul Fitzsimmons

I think i'll just let old boxes slide for a bit as good examples are obviously hot for some reason.

KC

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Re: Opinions? 1600s Gothic medieval 17th century oak bible box
« Reply #25 on: November 29, 2010, 03:02:39 pm »
Whew.....the prices on those boxes!
I'm from the South - but please don't mistake my Southern Manners/Accent/Charm as a weakness!