Another steal

[mariok54]

After picking up another Victorian Bed Warmer for next to nothing (You can never have enough bed warmers .. just ask Tales ) I looked to see what else the sellers had on offer and all they had was a porcelain candle stick which they said had a Meissen mark .. Well, we all know about the  Meissen crossed swords fan club, they were so fond of them that they copied it!

I could tell that this wasn't right, but my wife is fond of candle sticks, and this one will look good on the table next Christmas .. and I did a bit of research ... and so I placed a bid .. and got it for 99p ($1.50). The P&P will probably be another $4 - $5.

It isn't Meissen, but it is Franziska Hirsch, and the piece can only date to between 1894 - 1896, after this Meissen took out an injunction and so she had to stop using the crossed swords.

I think the sellers are away for Easter as they haven't yet got back to me.... but fingers crossed 

 



http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270737746439&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

[mart]

That is an absolutely beautiful candle stick !!!  Another home run for you !!!

[talesofthesevenseas]

You guys are gonna get me fired, I just laughed out loud at work!!

[mariok54]

I am surprised by the fact that I can still be surprised! The Bed warmer arrived after two weeks and a couple of reminders. This was after the seller making out that the woman who owned it was undergoing 'treatment' and he didn't know where the items were, seemingly to have completely forgotten that it was obvious from his earlier e-mail when he advised me of the postage, that the items were his!

However, despite several e-mails asking for the postage on the candlestick (recall it only cost me 99p) including mentions of it in the bed warmer reminders, I've heard (as we say over here) not a sausage!

I think that they were really disappointed with the fact that I was the only bidder and won it for the opening bid, and they probably still think that it is Meissen, and they probably didn't believe me when I assured them that it wasn't.

It isn't the money that gets up my nose, but the principle, as I expect people, in business,  to treat me as I would treat them. I also can't understand why someone would risk negative feedback for something like this? Maybe they think that it is worth it if they can keep the candlestick. I don't like having to leave negative feedback, but I've e-mailed them to say that I am prepared to do so, even over a 99p item.
This is the downside of ebay as opposed to buying from a more conventional auction. Although the item is legally yours, they don't need to hand it over!

[waywardangler]

Legally, they do. It is a legal contract according to eBay. I guess the sellers would rather risk their reputation and legal action over 99p. Can't fix stupid.

Avarice and greed. Some sellers, no matter what venue they choose, seem to think the items they have and hold have a 'set' value and will not part with them for a perceived cheaper than dirt opening price. Any item, in actuality, only has value at a particular point in time. The value thus constantly changes with time. If sellers perceive their item(s) to be worth x amount, then the opening bid or reserve should be at that price. They may find, they are the only ones that value their item that much and may have it for much longer than expected. A 'til death do us part scenario at which point the fire sale takes place and value is reached for that point in time. I see it all the time.

I laugh at estimates or worth given on various shows. When someone hears their item is worth $500-$750, they only hear the $750 number and not the low estimate. Of course trying to sell it at a retail price takes much time and effort on the sellers part. Something most people have no idea about.

[mart]

Some of those shows have such unrealistic values !!  When the actual selling price would be about half that !!  Fun to watch but we all know better !!

[waywardangler]

I love it when they say auction estimate, insurance value, or retail price. The only one that is accurate is the insurance value and that is only good if the object is stolen, damaged by fire, hail, wind, water, or ? That insurance covers the replacement (hopefully) cost of replacing it with an identical item RIGHT NOW. Some items, of course, are irreplaceable and you will never find a like item on the market anywhere at anytime (such as a one-of-a-kind woodcarving that perishes in a fire).
The auction estimate is only an estimate and the item can go for more, less, or go unsold. Fees must be deducted from the auction venue.
No one will pay you a retail price but a gallery would sell you an item at retail. If they sell your item, they will charge a commission or consignment fee.I agree with mart, most selling prices should be half of a quoted price or even lower. On common items, one would be lucky to get a tenth of the "value" and on really rare, great items, one could get twice the value or even more if the demand is there.
I love it when I see something I am interested in and the seller says "someone said that is worth X amount of dollars" so that is what I want. The "someone" should pay the seller that amount then. Ain't gonna happen.

[mart]

All these shows have even affected prices at flea markets and garage sales here !!

[waywardangler]

Same here. I chuckle at the ones that have an eBay sheet next to them.  As if here in this local market someone is going to pay the same $ as a worldwide market. What are they thinking? Put it on eBay and see what your item goes for, then do all the packing, shipping, etc. if it is so easy.

[talesofthesevenseas]

I have always figured that when they say "If we were to sell this piece in my gallery dahhhhling, I would price it at fifty-thousand dollars." That these are high-end dealers with inflated prices that cater to a wealthy crowd.

[mariok54]

I'm certainly getting my money's worth out of this one 

Absolutely no response from the seller, even after I threatened them with negative feedback, that is until I complained to ebay and left neg feedback. Then I received an e-mail from the seller and a £1 refund via Paypal. The e-mail said that they couldn't find the item and so it had probably been packed away in storage (they've still got new items up for sale!!). Hoping for an end to the story, no doubt. I hate being lied to (as they attempted in a previous e-mail) and I hate being fobbed off!
So I've explained the rules to them, about once an item is sold on ebay then ownership transfers from the vendor to the buyer, and 'possibly having packed it away' is insufficient reason not to conclude the agreement.

[waywardangler]

The e-mail said that they couldn't find the item

...hahahahahaha! That's a good one! I wonder how long it will take before they find it and re-list it at a higher opening price? They just did not want to sell it for their opening price. That is a risk anyone that sells on eBay takes. One bid and sold for the opening bid. A seller must average all their sales because some will be at a loss, some about right, and a few at great profit. Kind of like the stock market.

As to getting your moneys worth out of this, mario, we do not need much prodding to expound our views on this forum. 

[mariok54]

Well, I am like a terrier when there are principles involved. Despite my returning the refunded £1 telling the seller I wanted my item (well, my wife is the one who really wanted it), Ebay, in their wisdom, which seems to fall considerably short of Solomon's, decided to 'Find in my favour' and refunded my 99p !!!  So I told them exactly what I thought about their handling of the case:

I am disappointed with the way that you have managed this dispute, as I cannot see how this has been found in my favour, when I have already returned a refund once to the seller, maintaining that I wanted the item that I had bought and paid for. If the seller admits that they still have the item, then how on Earth can you possibly think that this outcome is at all satisfactory to me? It is not a question of the money, I only paid 99p for an item that might, if sold on, realise £5 - £10, but a matter of principle, and of confidence. How can anyone buy with confidence through Ebay, if the seller can just refuse to post the item out if they believe it has not realised the hoped for price? If that is the sort of practice that you condone, then I shall remember that next time I list something which doesn't realise the anticipated price. If you've decided to dismiss this case because of the tiny amount of money involved, then I think that you need to understand that the principle will be the same whether the final bid is 99p or £99, a contract is a contract. Perhaps you now believe that you (Ebay) are so big, with a virtual monopoly in the on-line auction world, that you no longer need to consider the 'individual', but without the individuals who buy and sell Ebay would not exist.

And this must be an all time record .. I got a reply within 1/2 hour ...


Hello Mario,

Thank you for contacting eBay Customer Support about the candle holder (item 270737746439 ) you bought from "magibaridi " which hasn't arrived yet. I'm sorry to hear that the transaction did not go as expected.

First, I do understand that you want this item from this seller and you have a principle that you are fighting for but here on eBay before we are making decision in every case that we handle we make sure that we review the case thoroughly. We are not just looking on the amount of the item. We considered many factors in decision making.

If you thought that your seller refuses to send the item to you because you didn't able to meet his anticipated price and will try to relist the item for higher bid or price in the future then we do not tolerate fraudulent activities and for us to review the account of the seller, we strongly recommend that you report the seller so that we can investigate and do the necessary actions.

As soon as a buyer wins an item, by being the highest bidder in an auction or using Buy It Now, the buyer and seller enter into a contract. The seller must sell the goods and the buyer must pay for them.

The seller may not refuse to accept payment or fail to deliver an item for which they have accepted payment. They may not send an item different to that described or pictured in the listing. Here is how to report the seller:

1. Log In to "My eBay".
2. Click on "Contact Us" on upper right part of the page.
3. Type in "Report a Seller" then click on "Ask"
4. Choose "How can I report a listing that appears to be breaching eBay ...- opens in a new window or tab?"
5. There will be a Pop-up window then you will be asked to report a policy offence. For your future reference please read through the page for more useful information.

As a valued eBay customer, we want to make sure you get help when you need it. If you have any questions or need advice, feel free to give us a call 08003586551 to speak to our Customer Support. Our operating hours are below:

Monday-Friday 8:00 AM - 10:00 PM
Saturday-Sunday 9:00 AM - 6:00 PM

For faster service please use a PIN. To get your PIN, please log in to your eBay account and click on "Contact Us".

I trust this information is helpful and I wish you all the best on eBay in the future.


Kind Regards,

Angela Samers
eBay Customer Support

I'm not quite sure that they actually answered my question as to how they felt that was a fair decision on their part .. It also seems that they're expecting us to police the activities of dodgy sellers! 

[waywardangler]

Unfortunately, mario, from what I have read on various other sites, such as Auctionbytes, eBay doesn't really care about all the small fish, buyers or sellers. They are the BIG fish and until it dies from some disease, old age, or is just too bloated to move anymore, they are going to do whatever they want. They do not have to please you, just the stockholders. I would love to see a really viable competitor on the net but alas, there is none. eBay seems to forget it was all the small sellers and buyers that got it where it is.  Maybe eBay will suffer like WalMart is when it got so-o-o-o big it knew what was good for the customers and removed a bunch of products and remodeled their stores. Customers left and WalMart suffered losses. When that happens to eBay, the stockholders will demand some adjustments. I think it is a matter of time. I think it is a power problem that many CEOs suffer from. Meg Whitman spent millions of her own money to try and get elected and, golly, she lost. Maybe eBay buyers and sellers voted against her? I wonder what would happen if Donahoe ran in a political race?

By the way, I rarely shop at WalMart anymore because I cannot find a thing, the selections are decreased, and gas is too high for a special trip. Why drive 10 miles when 1 mile will do?