wullie! stripping question (no not that kind!)

[ghopper1924]

Go Chris!

Schooled!!!!

[bigwull]

Mixer!!.....

[mart]

What I would do with stains this bad is just to hide and blend as it is !! I have removed or lightened normal oxidation with denatured alcohol but don`t think it would work on this one !! Artists oil paint and a few brushes will blend it in so it hides well !! Light varnish over top and buff all together so no extra shine !!

[cogar]

(Reply #27) Note: those stains are the reason for the old general rule to NEVER use metal tools when working with those high toxic paint strippers. Not only the old nails, but also hinges and of course the tools all ruined the woodwork.

As the old folks use to say, …. “Different strokes for different folks”.

Now I have repaired and refinished a lot of wood items during my past years and have used probably a couple dozen different types of “strippers”, paint & varnish removers, etc. And for “scraping” tools, …. just about anything I could get my hands on that would “do the job”.

But now the “stripper” you use depends on the type of “finish” you are trying to remove and the type of “tools” you use depends on the type of “wood” you are working with, plus, …. the type & direction of the “grain” of that part of the wood from which you are trying to remove the old “finish”.

Anyway, when used correctly, I have never experienced a problem by use of metal tools and three (3) of my very favorites if refinishing a piece like Sapphire’s oak sideboard would be my “bent & ground-sharp” screwdriver, my mowing machine “cutter-bar” knives and a “steel” wire brush.

And as far as any reaction to metal tools, hinges or nails, I personally would not be worried about the “high toxicity” of any paint strippers …. unless it could only be purchased in glass or plastic containers.     


****************************************

(Reply #29) that sideboard is no more white oak..than I am a Chinaman.....oops ……

Now Bigwull, your gonna confuse a lot of people by such comments who don’t comprehend the difference between when you are stating factual information and when you are just voicing your witty satire.

Thus, for the above mentioned "people", to wit:

Quercus alba, the white oak, is one of the pre-eminent hardwoods of eastern North America.

White oak has tyloses that give the wood a closed cellular structure, making it water- and rot-resistant. Because of this characteristic, white oak is used for barrels for wine and whiskey production since it resists leaking. It has also been used in construction, shipbuilding, cooperage, agricultural implements, and in the interior finishing of houses.[3]
 
It was a signature wood used in mission style oak furniture by Gustav Stickley in the Craftsman style of the Arts and Crafts movement.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quercus_alba

And ps, those whiskey barrels are not exactly 100% air and water tight, to wit:

When a wine or spirit ages in a barrel, small amounts of oxygen are introduced as the barrel lets some air in. Oxygen enters a barrel when water or alcohol is lost due to evaporation, a portion known as the "angels' share".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barrel

[bigwull]

Chris,If I may call you that,...I am somewhat confused,....which is not uncommon for me at time,s what with,having to contend with different ways of spelling,and with,some people who don,t know if there here, there.,..or everywhere,.and want what we try to give them...set in stone.....
but now to the question in hand...you stated and I
quote;..(That sideboard is made of White Oak which is one of the most porous of wood types)...the colour of oak aside....whether it be white, red, medium or light,I discard dark because we both know it is,nt, is of no importance.....what is important...is its "water resistant properties"......now i do know enough about wood in general, having served my time as a Carpenter,and with also having had an uncle who was a Cooper,....and i do know about things like the "angels share"...when it comes to storing whisky...and i also know that even well seasoned wood , like oak,...in fact almost all woods, do absorb water...when first used,especially in shipbuilding....but once that absorbing process is over...the wood in question...is as water resistant as it will ever be,and therefore  it is not the most porous of woods....

as for .".my witty satire"........this statement...in itself....may confuse...as it has various definitions..one of which is... satire - witty language used to convey insults or scorn,.....now i will admit...that i do not suffer fools gladly..and am not afraid to speak my mind.....but i prefer to call what i write.at times ...witty..anecdotes ....

[mart]

I personally do not see the type of oak as a problem and like Cogar I have used all types of tools and most were metal !! I have never seen nor had a problem like this from what I have used no matter the wood type !!  But that is not to say it doesn`t happen !!  I would not dispute others experiences with it !!  But it could be that whoever refinished this one used his own concoction and/or used a combination of chemicals that caused this !!  I do think that the stains on this are way too deep to be removed by sanding or similar methods !!

[bigwull]

Having looked at these marks again...what i find confusing.."my favourite word of late"..is the sporadic way in which these marks have appeared...now it is being mooted that where these stains have occurred, is where there are nails,and that this oxidisation, has happened because of whatever chemical process has been used,..it has caused the stains,..but looking at the top of the sideboard...i do not see nails being used in securing the top to the frame,..cabinet makers would not face fix...all the fixings would be from underneath the top,and the same can almost certainly be said of the rest of this sideboard...further more,if it established that some form of chemical stripper has been used...i would expect a more general staining to have occurred...but this has not happened...i like Mart, am of the opinion that these unsightly stains may well benefit from a light to medium sanding,starting off with possibly an 800 grade sandpaper...then with a 1000,...1200, ...then finishing with 0000 stainless wool,...then it can be varnished with a colour enhancing varnish...of choice......

[mart]

Well,, Never let it be said that you can`t learn from TV !! Was watching Restoration Roadshow and they were working on similar stains on an oak piece !! Didn`t say what caused them,, but oxalic acid was used carefully applied to the stain only and it removed all traces of the stain  !!  Like this piece they were pretty bad !!  So maybe a light sand and an application of oxalic acid will remove these !!  Shouldn`t be difficult to find it if its commonly used !!

[bigwull]

So what your saying is, it is possible to teach an old dog new tricks......."Not that i,m saying you,re a dog"...i thought i,d better add that, just in case it was mis-construed....

[bigwull]

Here you are...readily available...and as they would say..just what the doctor ordered...

http://www.woodfinishsupply.com/OxalicAcid.html

[mart]

Don`t worry Wullie,, it wasn`t !!  LOL  And yes !! We can still learn a few things !!

[cogar]

Well now, Wuffie, in that you admit to being somewhat confused on the wood issue of my post … I will forgive you for addressing me as “Chris”.  Like the ole fellow said, .. better to be addressed than undressed. 

Anyway, Bigwull, when I made the statement that …. “White Oak which is one of the most porous of wood types” I did so because I …. uh, … uh, …. also do know enough about wood types in general and their individual criteria specifically, having served many hours as a student of nature, a carpenter, cabinetmaker, re-modeler, restorer, refinisher and a student of Botany  …. to know that all wood types do in fact have the capabilities of absorbing and transporting water. And I was not specifically speaking about water absorption when I stated the above “porosity” thingy, Said comment was in reference to the “tubular” size of the wood “grain”. The larger diameter the “grain”, the more porous the wood.

The technical name for said “transport” mechanism is “xylem”, which is commonly known as “growth rings” and/or “wood grain” depending on the view, and which is a “tubular” structure for transporting water and nutrients between the roots and the tree canopy. Different species of trees have different size xylem tubes, which is often referred to as “loose grain” or “tight grain”. A tree grows a new xylem layer at the start of each new growth season, but the older xylem still retains considerable moisture, and thus the reason firewood and new sawn lumber should be “air” dried or ”kiln” dried for lumber, before using. The xylem transports said water via capillary action, thus anytime the grain ends are exposed it will either absorb or excrete water depending on whether its environment is wet or dry.     

Given the above, oak has rather large grain, pine has a little smaller, whereas maple has extremely small grain. Thus, if you are going to apply a stain to “new sawn” oak or pine, you best first apply a “wood filler” or their open grain ends will “suck-up” the stain faster than you can wipe it off …. resulting in “dark and light areas” that can only be cured by putting the wood back thru a planer. But with maple, ya almost have to let the stain dry on top of the wood, except for the “end” cuts.     

Bigwull, I hope that was less confusing for you ….. even though I did get quite “mouthy” in my response.

[bigwull]

Well now, Wuffie, in that you admit to being somewhat confused on the wood issue of my post … I will forgive you for addressing me as “Chris”.  Like the ole fellow said, .. better to be addressed than undressed. 

Anyway, Bigwull, when I made the statement that …. “White Oak which is one of the most porous of wood types” I did so because I …. uh, … uh, …. also do know enough about wood types in general and their individual criteria specifically, having served many hours as a student of nature, a carpenter, cabinetmaker, re-modeler, restorer, refinisher and a student of Botany  …. to know that all wood types do in fact have the capabilities of absorbing and transporting water. And I was not specifically speaking about water absorption when I stated the above “porosity” thingy, Said comment was in reference to the “tubular” size of the wood “grain”. The larger diameter the “grain”, the more porous the wood.

The technical name for said “transport” mechanism is “xylem”, which is commonly known as “growth rings” and/or “wood grain” depending on the view, and which is a “tubular” structure for transporting water and nutrients between the roots and the tree canopy. Different species of trees have different size xylem tubes, which is often referred to as “loose grain” or “tight grain”. A tree grows a new xylem layer at the start of each new growth season, but the older xylem still retains considerable moisture, and thus the reason firewood and new sawn lumber should be “air” dried or ”kiln” dried for lumber, before using. The xylem transports said water via capillary action, thus anytime the grain ends are exposed it will either absorb or excrete water depending on whether its environment is wet or dry.     

Given the above, oak has rather large grain, pine has a little smaller, whereas maple has extremely small grain. Thus, if you are going to apply a stain to “new sawn” oak or pine, you best first apply a “wood filler” or their open grain ends will “suck-up” the stain faster than you can wipe it off …. resulting in “dark and light areas” that can only be cured by putting the wood back thru a planer. But with maple, ya almost have to let the stain dry on top of the wood, except for the “end” cuts.     

Bigwull, I hope that was less confusing for you ….. even though I did get quite “mouthy” in my response.

What has all of the above...got to do with the price of Carrots.....

[cogar]

It made them more affordable and thus one can better see the err of their assumptions. 

[KC]

I think you should intentionally put iron oxide marks all over the piece and make the whole item spotted (like a dalmatian)!  Call it an exotic wood!