A Pair of Chairs

[Gustos]

Hello everyone, I have a pair of chairs that I unfortunately know very little about. I am hoping to ask you all for some help figuring out what they are. They appear to be a his and hers set. They were found in a basement in New Jersey in the 1950's. They have been in my family since then. That's about all I know. Maybe after seeing some photos, somebody might recognize them. Thank you for any assistance and knowledge you can provide.

[KC]

Welcome and thank you for posting!

Can you tell if the seat has springs in it?  Can you post a picture of the undersides of the pieces?

Beautiful.  Trying to determine if late Victorian or a reproduction done in the depression era.

[frogpatch]

They appear to be Victorian Renaissance Revival chairs. I personally have never seen them reproduced in the 30s but I have seen reproductions later. That does not mean there are none. I am sure there are. The patina on these looks good in the picture. I would like to know the answer to KCs question. They are also probably stuffed with horsehair. Unfortunately you can't check that without damaging them.

[Rauville]

You might try searching for “John Jelliff”;  furniture maker from Newark, New Jersey. His shop was known for Renaissance Revival chairs of this type.           
http://rarevictorian.com/shop/?site=John-Jelliff                   

[Ipcress]

They are top quality. Have to be period chairs - maybe 1870-80 ?

Those wonderfully carved arms - very similar to those here ( same features, hair, swept neck, " tassle " at the front )

http://www.liveauctioneers.com/item/5146547

and again here

http://www.liveauctioneers.com/item/2793423

Rauville seems to have been spot on with Jelliff

[Rauville]

Rauville seems to have been spot on with Jelliff

No, I doubt if I was spot on, but I appreciate the support Ipcress. If you ever want to start a heated discussion, just announce that you have a “Jelliff chair”. Someone will say “No, that’s a Hamburger”; then someone will suggest “Maybe a Schrenkeisen?”. Since there has never been a signed piece of Jelliff furniture discovered (to my knowledge), the best one can say is “in the style of” or “attributed to”. But starting with reading about Jelliff is a good place to begin in my opinion.

[mart]

Not many have read about Jelliff !!  Pretty sure these are not his, but one of the later ones !!  Not really his way of styling a chair !!   Did you have these chairs recovered ??

[Gustos]

Hello Everbody,
Thanks for all the responses, way to make a guy feel welcome! I'll send some more close ups and check for springs.

I seem to remember a photo of my grandfather with these chairs, possibly as they were found in the basement. I think my memory is them being un-upholstered. The house in Jersey was close to the shore line. It was this beautiful old Victorian with amazing interior wood carvings. I have old photos of the area after a hurricane hit. The water had at least filled the basement of the home. So that may explain the condition you'll see in the photos.

I don't know exactly what you mean by recovered?

Thanks again for all this great information.

[Ipcress]

Rauville seems to have been spot on with Jelliff

No, I doubt if I was spot on, but I appreciate the support Ipcress. If you ever want to start a heated discussion, just announce that you have a “Jelliff chair”. Someone will say “No, that’s a Hamburger”; then someone will suggest “Maybe a Schrenkeisen?”. Since there has never been a signed piece of Jelliff furniture discovered (to my knowledge), the best one can say is “in the style of” or “attributed to”. But starting with reading about Jelliff is a good place to begin in my opinion.

Those arms are very distinctive and haven't seen them on furniture attributed to other designers.

Might be someone taught by Jelliff ( like " school of " with painters ) but i think it's safe to use his name when describing these

[Gustos]

A few more.

[Gustos]

The smaller of the two.

[jacon4]

Yeah, I am going with the "attributed to" or "in the style of" Jelliff. Rare Victorian did many threads on this maker over the years and, according to Ulysses Dietz at the Newark Museum, there are only 2 known signed pieces by Jelliff.
http://victorianforum.com/antique-furniture-attributions/furniture-attributed-to-john-jelliff/

[Ipcress]

Beautiful. There's a walnutty look to them in a couple of the photos, although rosewood in others.

And even a cobweb for good measure !


Worth reading this page, where someone attempts to attribute the piece to Schrenkeisen

http://rarevictorian.com/2009/02/m-h-schrenkeisen-sofa-with-carved-bust-arms.html

Read the post by Ulysses Dietz.

This is the sofa in the Newark museum he speaks of

http://gallery.newarkmuseum.org/view/objects/asitem/Objects@3151905/3/title-desc;jsessionid=0FCE9998768ACD146A2742848D6878D3?t:state:flow=f7e18ec4-bc62-41af-8929-0407189ee720

[jacon4]

Worth reading this page, where someone attempts to attribute the piece to Schrenkeisen

Yeah, This is what happens when cabinetmakers do not mark their work. What happens in the Jelliff case, every maker that has a female bust arm (Jenny Lind head) are attributed to Jelliff as a marketing tool whether it was built by Jelliff or not.
BTW, the "Jenny Lind" thing is bogus as well, no one really knows what or who the carved female head represents.

[Ipcress]

Far more likely to be a generic female bust based on someone like Minerva than Jenny Lind.

On Victorian pennies you have the Queen herself on the obverse with Britannia on the reverse - the image was everywhere during the 19th century.
Strong, dominant, intelligent women...who weren't allowed to vote !

The Victorians made damn fine furniture, though.