old china

[MikeB]

Hi everyone,

I have this china I was told is hand painted and old and rare.

Can anyone tell me it's origin?

Incomplete set but really neat stuff, certainly seems hand painted. I know it was my grandmothers.

[mart]

Look on the bottom of the plates and see if there is a name !!  No its transferware !!  Only part that is usually hand done on this type is the gold border !!

[MikeB]

There are only 4 digit numbers on the back of the saucers and the plates as well.

The reason I suggest hand painted is because each one seems a little different than the other. I can take a few more pictures to show you what I mean.

[MikeB]

Some have 4 digit numbers and some nothing.

Looking at the flowers though they are all differently done. Course I don't know what that means, it was just suggested to me that that meant they were hand painted.

Thanks for your reply.

[mart]

No,, pretty sure these are transferware !!  First of all,, does it make logical sense that any factory/pottery would spend triple the cost to make something but not put the factory/pottery name on it !!  I mean thats why they are producing these,, to sell !!  But how would anyone know where to buy them without a name ??  Doesn`t make any business sense does it ??  The number on the back is the mold number and sometimes they made items in more than one run and mold numbers did vary even with identical pieces depending on the run sequence !!  They had more than one or two molds for the same piece !!  As to the pattern,, just the placement is different but of the ones I could see well enough to match were almost identical !!  They could vary slightly after firing but very little !! 

[MikeB]

Hey thanks Mart!

Now that I look closer I see three different patterns to the main part of the plates.

Thanks for teaching me what transferware is!

[cogar]

I agree with Mart, the pattern is, per se, “transfer ware” because it is a much too complex pattern to be painted individually.

And “yes”, the patterns vary, ….. are different, ……. simply because they had several different transfer “patterns” to be applied at random prior to the ‘glaze’ being applied ……..before the final “firing”.

[mart]

That is not to say it is not nice china,, its very pretty and the cobalt blue is always popular !!  Transfers have been used a lot longer than you might think !!

[cogar]

Transferware has been around ever since Bowser was justa a little pup.

In fact, …….. “ ….. transfer printing as a decorative technique was developed in England in the mid-1750s, particularly in the Staffordshire region.”

Read more @  https://www.thesprucecrafts.com/transferware-timeless-decorative-art-147949

And to see lots of examples of “antique blue and white transferware”, ….. click this link:
https://duckduckgo.com/?q=antique+blue+and+white+transferware&t=h_&iax=images&ia=images

[Pelady]

The US required Porcelain to be labeled with country of origin back in the 1890s. He is an article on dating China.
http://www.coxsackie.com/reference/cooaadt.htm

Lots of German and Czechoslovakian China never had a brand name or a pattern name on its dishes.
Your dishes are beautiful do you have a complete set? China has gone way down in antique value. If you are not planning to keep it, Best way is to sell it as pieces.
Do you do a Google picture search for the cup or plate? 

[MikeB]

Hi Pelady,

Thanks for the response. I haven't done a google search for the plate or cup but I will try and figure out how to do that. Looking through random pictures of China I haven't seen the pattern anywhere yet. I do really like the pattern myself.

If it was worth alot I would sell it but if it isn't I'll just keep it. Sadly I do need $$ so the more my things are worth the more likely I am to sell them at this point in time. A shame but it is what it is for me currently.

I have 2 decent sized plates, 11 saucers, 12 dessert plates, 8 tea cups, the creamer dish and a sugar bowl. I imagine it should have had a teapot but alas I do not have that.

I do have a couple other full sets that I will be selling for sure, perhaps I should post those as well? They are stamped with royal majestic fine china d'or. Somerset by NL excel? and wedgewood bone china made in england, doric.

I also have 5 or 10 assorted old china plates with different manufacturers on them, Be glad to post them if anyone had any input on them. I just don't want to go post crazy on here unless people are interested.

[mart]

Ha !!  We are always interested !!  The Wedgwood set sound interesting !!

[KC]

The Wedgewood would most likely be the more expensive of the sets depending on the pattern.  Look forward to seeing pictures of the sets.

[MikeB]

Here is the Wedgewood set.

You'll have to excuse my terms for the items if they are wrong. I have no idea just guessing.

10 teacups
8 normal sized saucers and 2 slightly larger saucers
7 desert plates? and 2 slightly smaller desert plates
8 small bowls
8 dinner plates
2 serving platters
2 long concave dishes
1 double handed dish with lid

I added the last picture just because there is a teapot and sugar bowl of the royal charter that might have been used with this set if the origional teapot broke? No Wedgewood teapot anyway.

[mart]

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_nkw=Wedgwood+bone+china+doric+pattern&_sacat=472&rt=nc&LH_Sold=1&LH_Complete=1

Here are the sold items from Ebay !!  Only one set in your pattern !!
The bottom pic is from a different set !!