Could someone tell me what tis is?

[adrien]

Hello Everyone,
I'm a new menber on this site and am located in france.
I was wondering if someone could telle me what this is
It looks like some kind of a masterpiece, made of steel and brass;
It's 12 inch tall and 8 inch wide at the base, pretty heavy.
There is no marks, date or anything written on it. Seems to be hand made. Whoever did this must have spent some time on it.
I couldn't figure out how it works, because some parts are seized and some smaller parts seem to be missing.
Please have a look at those pictures:

 http://www.cijoint.fr/cjlink.php?file=cj201008/cijbyF5Ddj.jpg
 http://www.cijoint.fr/cjlink.php?file=cj201008/cijPSv8WyD.jpg
 http://www.cijoint.fr/cjlink.php?file=cj201008/cijitTeGew.jpg
 http://www.cijoint.fr/cjlink.php?file=cj201008/cijlE3ivKd.jpg
 http://www.cijoint.fr/cjlink.php?file=cj201008/cijQW7Yj7q.jpg

Thanks again and best regards from France

[hosman321]

Welcome Adrien! That is one complicated looking contraption. I have no idea what it is but I just wanted to say welcome and I hope someone on the forum can tell you and I both what it is! Are you able to take a picture of the top of it? I'm curious to see what the top looks like. Is that gray part somewhere that you pour something in? Something tells me I have seen something like this before and it had to do with liquor or wine. With you being in France, maybe it's something along those lines??

Oh, and I was a little confused about the pics at first. For everyone: you have to click on the link, scroll down and then click on the little picture.

[adrien]

Thanks for your message.

I have uploaded some other pictures showing the top part and the mechanism.
Seems like you had to put something on top but it looks like it's going nowhere.
If you had a close look at it, the mehanism is so comlicated that it looks a bit useless.
I've bought it in paris years ago to a 90 years old man. He told me that he has always seen it in his parent's house. He used to play with it when he was a kid but he couldn't tell me what this was for!

  http://www.cijoint.fr/cjlink.php?file=cj201008/cijf2y9TjG.jpg
  http://www.cijoint.fr/cjlink.php?file=cj201008/cijJ1ngrfC.jpg
  http://www.cijoint.fr/cjlink.php?file=cj201008/cijAOgPzbe.jpg
  http://www.cijoint.fr/cjlink.php?file=cj201008/cij5b3zt0V.jpg
  http://www.cijoint.fr/cjlink.php?file=cj201008/cijdFqCUSp.jpg
  http://www.cijoint.fr/cjlink.php?file=cj201008/cijMCuMtan.jpg

Thanks again
Adrien

[waywardangler]

Hmmm...another wonderment.  Have you contacted anyone in manufacturing to see if they were familiar with this?  It appears that the steel rod that the brass piston moves on is rusted as are other steel parts...or there is a heavy layer of cosmoline on them.  I think in order to figure this out (if you can't find someone familiar with it), you will need to free up all frozens parts to make it operable so you can see what does what.  Looks like a bunch of gear reductions, pistons, some hopper on top, etc.  Maybe it was used to make small parts of some sort but I do not see any punch type press in there.  No clue.

[regularjoe2]

Welcome to the forum , adrien .

What you have appears to be the works of an automaton .

From around the 1600's through the 1800's automata were produced and displayed in a variety of countries .
In the 1800's , the devices were often considered a rather expensive adult 'Parlor' amusement .

Such designers as Maillard , Jacques De Vaucanson , Pierre Jaquet-Doz , Joseph Faber and George Moore made famous automata .

There are still 3 examples of the excellent work of Jaquet-Doz (the Drauftsman , the Musician  & the Writer) that are in the museum of Art & History in Switzerland .

The 19th century was more or less the hey-day for production of such items that fascinated many folks .

I'd like to comment that yours might just be one that would be worthy of restoration to it's working state , if another identical one can be found (to figure out what parts are missing & can be duplicated) .

Thanks for posting your very cool item on the forum !

[KC]

RJ you beat me to it.  It is part of a automaton.

It appears that it was enclosed at some point in time....just a deep seeded feeling.

It would be awesome if you could free up the parts.....would love to see the movements!

http://blog.dugnorth.com/2008/04/automaton-by-vichy-clockwork-mechanism.html

These folks seem to be willing/able to answer any questions.  You might want to drop a line.
Please let us know what you find out.

Are there any markings/writing/imprints at all on the piece?

[Sara Finn]

I'm 100% with RJ2 & KC - automata!
I would love to see it fixed up & working!
 

[waywardangler]

An automaton?  Any guess as to what type it is?  Maybe an example?  That would be really neat if it could be restored and working.  Nice flyswatter example regjoe! This is why this site is the best!  Regjoe, KC, and sara have boatloads of knowledge to share!
So here I am at 11:27 PM my time reading about automata.  Interesting stuff.  On this site http://www.fi.edu/pieces/knox/automaton/autoworkings.htm The Franklin Institute received a piece that required total restoration.  Adrien, have you considered donating this to a museum or institute?  It may be a significant piece.

[KC]

FYI....just to let you know the value of full intact automatons......thi s is an example from an auction!!!!
http://www.theriaults.com/news/article.cfm?aid=184

When I get to my regular computer I will post saved links to my all time favorite automatons!

It won't let me post a new reply today...so I am adding on to this....

I am convinced that the large brass object makes some sort of sound - in pic
http://www.cijoint.fr/cjlink.php?file=cj201008/cijAOgPzbe.jpg.

I couldn't find where you have a view looking into the "chute" that appears on the top next to the arm.  Still believe it had some type of cover on it at one point......Let us know what you hear.  If you can't forward it on to some sites...I will.  I am totally intriqued!!!!!!!!!!!!

[adrien]

Thanks a million for all your messages.
I have checked it today and there is no markings at all not even a number.
If we can figure out what it is, i'd love to have it restored to see it working again.
But i was just wondering: If you had a look at the moving parts, looks like all those parts are moving at the same time but does not create a movement on the outside of the column. Everything is moving inside.
Could it be an automata that was created just for the beauty of the mechanism, i mean, with no moving parts on the outside ( like legs, arms, head...)
I'll drop a message at the automata blog soon; I'll let you know anyway.
thanks
 

[cogar]

Adrien, it looks to me like that round brassy thingy at the bottom right of your automaton might be "a piston operated noise maker"

[fancypants]

I'd agree with cogar  on the piston-operated bellows ; frequently used to air-power reeded fixtures/whistles/etc that imitated animal sounds , on automata .

[waywardangler]

It seems there would be a lot of things going on there but I do not see any connections.  Are there a number of rods, wires, etc. missing that would animate arms, legs, beaks, or movement?  If this was operable, would the sound the chamber makes lead to the identity of what this mechanism animated?  I just find it rather hard to believe, a mechanism this intense would not have been marked by the maker.  Maybe the name is under the rust somewhere?

[KC]

In case it got lost in my section above...I also agree that the item should have made a sound.  Many automatons mimicked birds...so wonder if it is a bird sound! 

Still wonder about the "chute" like object on the top...a view looking down into it would be appreciated.