Author Topic: Need Help Identifying This Unusual Item  (Read 9387 times)

hosman321

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Re: Need Help Identifying This Unusual Item
« Reply #15 on: March 05, 2011, 06:38:51 pm »
Nope, didn't work. But here is the description.

Chatelaine is a decorative belt hook or clasp worn at the waist with a series of chains suspended from it. Each chain is mounted with a useful household appendage such as scissors, thimble, watch, key, vinaigrette, household seal, etc.

Chatelaines were worn by many housekeepers in the 19th century. They were also worn by Anglo Saxon women, as seen from the burial record.

The name chatelaine derives from the same term used to mean the female owner, or wife of the owner, of a large house. Originally the chatelaine was designed to have all the tools necessary for the woman of the household to sort out any problem she may encounter in her day, like a fraying curtain, however with time the chatelaine and the objects it held evolved from being a purely utilitarian object into a decorative symbol that reflected the status of the wearer.


hosman321

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Re: Need Help Identifying This Unusual Item
« Reply #16 on: March 05, 2011, 06:56:07 pm »
I'm guessing the little bottle on yours is a scent (perfume) bottle. I bet a woman wore this and kept score on the green. Here are similar victorian chatelaines.

http://shop.ebay.com/i.html?_nkw=victorian+chatelaine&_sacat=0&_odkw=gold+chatelaine&_osacat=0&_trksid=p3286.c0.m270.l1313

mart

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Re: Need Help Identifying This Unusual Item
« Reply #17 on: March 05, 2011, 07:10:49 pm »
Well, didn`t think about that !!  Saw a pic of a Victorian room once and had one similarly shaped hanging in front of a window from a hook. Didn`t think about a deodorizer !! I just figured a pretty mobile !!  He didn`t say,, but how big is this thing ??  I am curious !!  All the chatelaines I have seen and that is in pics, were made a bit different from this object. They were made like the one on the other thread. This one looks like it hangs different.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2011, 07:16:06 pm by mart »

fancypants

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Re: Need Help Identifying This Unusual Item
« Reply #18 on: March 05, 2011, 07:53:08 pm »
I'd say that the bottle may have held snuff , rosin ('chalk') , talc or cocaine .... don't think it was for perfume or smelling salts though ... not large enough for 19th hole either .

Curious to know if the cylinder still contains pencil/leads (graphite) for scorecard ?

Cool little unit !
" Methinks me the 'mental' in sentimental .... "

talesofthesevenseas

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Re: Need Help Identifying This Unusual Item
« Reply #19 on: March 05, 2011, 08:06:16 pm »
Yes! You've got a BEAUTIFUL and highly collectable chatelaine. The lady of the house would wear this on her waist and have access to keys, pen, notebook, thimble etc. These are very popular with collectors. Reenactors like me drool over these! Congrats!
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mart

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Re: Need Help Identifying This Unusual Item
« Reply #20 on: March 05, 2011, 09:01:34 pm »
That would have to be the most uncomfortable thing to wear !!  Looks like the round object on the longest chain would hit about the knees !!  That would not have been fun to walk while wearing it !!

talesofthesevenseas

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Re: Need Help Identifying This Unusual Item
« Reply #21 on: March 05, 2011, 09:47:34 pm »
No, chatelaines aren't anywhere near that long. They just dangle from the belt. The items on them are usually only an inch or two so long.
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KC

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Re: Need Help Identifying This Unusual Item
« Reply #22 on: March 06, 2011, 12:33:08 am »
These were very common in  Victorian times and were called Chatelaines or Lorgnettes.

Usually though it was a dance card to be marked on or note pad.  The bottle generally would hold perfume and in some cases smelling salts.

A site with some examples:  http://www.morninggloryjewelry.com/chatelaine-aide-memoire-aid-63.html
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talesofthesevenseas

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Re: Need Help Identifying This Unusual Item
« Reply #23 on: March 06, 2011, 01:38:35 am »
Yes but... a lorgnette is a pair of opera glasses mounted on a handle.  :-\
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Marc-Barr

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Re: Need Help Identifying This Unusual Item
« Reply #24 on: March 06, 2011, 09:46:30 am »
First off, thanks to everyone for their helpful advice. Hosman321, Thanks for the research.I would not have known where to begin. I wonder if this can be adjusted?It hangs very low if it were to be attached to a skirt or even a jacket. It is very ornate and one person I showed it to said it looks as if it came from royalty.Again,thanks to everyone for the help and comments!

waywardangler

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Re: Need Help Identifying This Unusual Item
« Reply #25 on: March 06, 2011, 10:37:35 am »
I am coming to this thread late but have some observations. The top bar that everything is attached to would go through a buttonhole. All of these items would not be dangling about while someone is golfing, keeping score or whatever. The way these are arranged on various chains would have created a massive tangle in short order. These would have been in a pocket, to be pulled out when needed. I would guess this is from the late 1800s Victorian era as mentioned and the fact that there is a golf score card attached would make this EXTREMELY desired by golf collectors. Golf items from this era are very scarce and sought after. JMO.

mart

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Re: Need Help Identifying This Unusual Item
« Reply #26 on: March 06, 2011, 11:31:12 am »
   Wayward, Any idea why so many straight bars on it where the chain is attached at the end ?? I can see them in a pocket on a vest or something. Just never saw anything made like it !!

waywardangler

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Re: Need Help Identifying This Unusual Item
« Reply #27 on: March 06, 2011, 11:39:20 am »
No idea, mart. They are spreaders, so maybe they help to keep the chains from tangling? I was trying to find a golf scorecard of that vintage but have not yet. I think it is English/Scottish but not sure. If this was used by a woman golfer during the 1880s/90s, I think it would be quite valuable. This deserves more research by Marc-Barr in my opinion. The initials could lead to the owner/user. This must have been owned by a person of wealth and leisure.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2011, 11:41:50 am by waywardangler »

Marc-Barr

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Re: Need Help Identifying This Unusual Item
« Reply #28 on: March 06, 2011, 11:43:54 am »
I'm gonna ask because I'm sure others are thinking the same thing but what would something like this be worth? How does one go about appraising an item like this. I saw the ones on Ebay and some were rather modest($75) and others went up to several hundred dollars. Just curious.

waywardangler

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Re: Need Help Identifying This Unusual Item
« Reply #29 on: March 06, 2011, 11:51:28 am »
I really do not know, but would guess in the hundreds of dollars. A golf scorecard in a silver engraved and decorated holder for a golf scorecard is scarce to rare. Golfing related items of this vintage bring $$$ and $$$$. If you could determine the owner/user through the initials, the price would go up. I would not sell this until all research was exhausted. This would bring more money in the UK in my opinion as the history of the game is there, especially Scotland. In the US, we are stuck with well known American players from the 1940s to recent. IMO.

I have 1 book on golf collectibles and there is nothing remotely resembling this in there. I the pieces are silver and British, they should be hallmarked and it would be easy to date them with these hallmarks. I would go over them with a loupe and determine what marks are on all the pieces.

I see the mirror is Foster & Bailey (F&B in a flag). I had a cigarette case with this mark dated 1910. The scorecard itself appears to be celluloid. The initials appear to be (in order) AAS so usually the last initial is in the middle so the name initials would be A.S.A.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2011, 12:15:50 pm by waywardangler »